[Rockie28]

I've got an 06 SE Ultra Classic that has always been tough to start after it's warmed up or hot. If I stop for gas or something, I can't start it right back up, without a struggle. The dealer doesn't know what's causing it, some kind of short or something. The battery is fine. I'm thinking it's a starter problem, but they don't seem to. The ECM was recently "blanked out" and they've never seen that happen before so they say. Now it's struggling with cold starts too, it makes a loud popping sound then after 2-3 tries it starts. Today before it started a ton of smoke came from the engine, hell... I was waiting for the flames to start. Something has to be burning..right?

I just wondered if anyone had any ideas on what to tell them to check out when I take it back AGAIN for service. Thanks!!

[chucktx]

are you able to be a bit more specific on the symptoms???? "hard to start" is a wide range. also, what did the smoke smell like??? oil, plastic, wood, ect....where is the poping sound comming from??? starter area, carb/inj area, battery area??? the more specific info ya give us, the better we can help.....hope this helps ya a bit.....

[Rockie28]

Well...it sounds like it wants to crank up, but doesn't turn over, not like the low battery sound though. The battery voltage is about 15. Sometimes it makes a hesitation(very little sound or low power) then starts up, kind of like an after thought. But longer I hold the start button the worst it sounds. I'm use to just pushing the electric starter and have it start after a few seconds. This bike I'll hold it and after about 5 secs if it doesn't turn over I stop pushing the button and retry the electric fuel injector before trying to start it again. It will start right up maybe 5/10 times, unless the engine is hot. The smoke smells like burning oil or rubber and it come out from under the air filter. The popping sound comes more from the lower part of the engine(voltage regulator) and exhaust area. The bike runs fine... AFTER it starts.

I have a SE tuning kit on it. I also replaced the cams/push rods when they had to tear everything down to fix two leaks one in the rocker box and the other in the cylinder by the rear spark plug. The starting problem was there before all the repairs and upgrades. Hope this helps ..Thanks!!!

[Dakota]

This is just a wild as- guess, but is it possible it's the starter clutch going out? When mine went out I thought it was kicking back when I hit the starter button and sometimes it would belch a little fog (or something like that) back out the air cleaner, when it started to spin and then didn't continue spinning. Then on several times, it would just start normally, but it usually only did it when it was hot. I thought mine was a low battery or bad cables. I replaced all of that even though everything looked good and it didn't help at all.
But once I put a new starter clutch on it everything was fine. Also when the clutch is going out it makes some noises from the starter area, which I assume is the noise it makes when it slips.
You might want to run that bythem unless you want to do it yourself. I'm not sure how you check a starter clutch, I just replaced mine
I got mine from here:Harley Davidson starters and gears - other street bike starters
as they have a lifetime warranty-for whatever that's worth.

[Rockie28]

Thanks Dakota !! I will run that by them.

[Dakota]

Let us know what you find out when you do.

[hotroadking]

Well it sounds to me like you're running a really high compression type cam like a woods 6H maybe some high comp pistons,

What is the cranking pressure on the cyl, have you tested that?

If you have a high compression motor and go for a hot restart, ie, cell call, light up a smoke, quick fuel then go to start the bike you get kick back.

That happens when the fuel hits the cyl because the piston tops are still burning hot, this ignites the initial charge and fires it without the spark plug, like a diesel you have a compression motor at that point, it fires the flywheels backwards giving you that klunk.

When you go to restart try this,

1) do not twist the throttle don't even touch it
2) no choke
3) Bump the start button lightly to turn over the motor, i bet you get a quick move or a little carb fart out the carb
4) once that happens you've cleared the cyl, now hit the starter, bet it fires each time.

What cam and piston combo, what is the compression, what is the cranking pressure on the cyl. Have you tuned it, what is the Afr is it running lean>?

[skull2007]

sounds like something electronic. is your race tuner setup right? i'm assuming your starter is turning the engine well. i'd be thinking about the ecm or some sensor for two reasons:

1. the thing about something going blank?

2. the fact that temp. seems to affect the problem

seems the stealer should be able to run diagnostics and at least tell if your ecm is good along with the race tuner. think maybe about the sensor that acts like a choke i think it's called a throttle position sensor

hope this helps

[Dakota]

Have you had a chance to run any of this by the dealer yet? Just wondering what is wrong. Any info might help one of us later on if we have the same problem.

[FriendGregory]

Just wondering where this was going, any updates?
I know mine floods real easy. At this point I have had so many backfires I think I might start hunting duck from my front yard. The good point is I am getting stronger pushing the bike back into the garage.

[Rockie28]

Well....the dealer said it was a problem with my tuner kit and the ECM. They forgot to download an update, which caused my fuel levels to MAX out...flooding the bike. I even blew a plug. Since, I got it back it has started easier, without too much hesitation. Hopefully the problem is solved.

The back firing you're having my be related to a tuning problem. Just a thought because I'm far from being a mechanic. Good luck!!

[chucktx]

Originally Posted by FriendGregory

Just wondering where this was going, any updates?
I know mine floods real easy. At this point I have had so many backfires I think I might start hunting duck from my front yard. The good point is I am getting stronger pushing the bike back into the garage.

this is how i would approch your starting problem. i would not touch the throttle at all. use the enrichner at about 1/2, then hit the button. you may have to experiment with the enricner/choke, but dont use the throttle untill it gets running. if you are happy with the way the bike runs after starting, you are good to go. if you are not happy, you may need to do a few simple mods to the carb.........

[FriendGregory]

Rockie28 thanks for the update, damm electronics. So, yours is fuel injected. I know I did a bit of a highjack but this is about hard starting.

Originally Posted by chucktx

this is how i would approch your starting problem. i would not touch the throttle at all. use the enrichner at about 1/2, then hit the button. you may have to experiment with the enricner/choke, but dont use the throttle untill it gets running. if you are happy with the way the bike runs after starting, you are good to go. if you are not happy, you may need to do a few simple mods to the carb.........

Yes, I was estatic with how well it ran the last few times out; then a no start. I am still in experiment mode. This morning about 10 hours after flooding it, I turned the gas on, cranked it for a couple seconds without touching anything but the start button, then started cranking it, slowly feeding it throttle; started fine. Come to think of it, my son was playing on it earlier and I had found it in gear. Maybe he pre flooded it for me this time.

About the "use the enrichner at about 1/2", mine is a Mikuni 40mm (and I am sure the previous owner did not read your tech section), is the enrichener the same as a choke? Because the thing is spring loaded and is only on for the amount of time I want to stay bent over flooding the engine.

[chucktx]

actually an enrichner and choke are different animals, but do about the same.....add gas for cold starts. check to see if there isnt a knob that you can tighten down a bit to hold it's position. it will be right next to the mounting tab. it may look like it is holding the assembly to the bracket, but turn it to see if it will lock the shaft.......that is how the cv's work....