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Oct 17th, 2006, 04:07 PM
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#21 | | Administrator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 1,563 Interests: Fishing, wood working, flipping off Fred Fox Occupation: Founder of Bike Talk....retired and lovin' it
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Originally Posted by Sleepy  You don't like Toyotas?? | It isn't that I do not like Toyota's or Honda's etc at all. It is the simple fact that between Honda and Toyota they have single handedly destroyed open wheel racing in America. CART nearly went under and IRL really should be called the HRL (Honda Racing League) since it is now the spec engine making the IRL more like a club circuit than a competitive organization. CART nearly went belly up completely and one of the causes was the money being dumped into the Honda engine program. The Craftsman truck series is turning into a Toyota benefit with Toyota winning nine of the last eighteen races. The problem I see is that the costs for every teams engine programs will go higher and higher due to the designed from scratch Toyota racing V8. NASCAR is slow to recognize and react to anything but debris calls when needed  . Ford, Chevy and Dodge have all asked for an engine review program so that they could at least be on a level playing field and NASCAR has denied them. Rousch tested a truck series engine and it was within 30 HP of a cup car engine. Toyota's mouth piece Mikey the motor mouth Waltrip, claims that Toyota is not buying up talent yet, several drivers have either signed with future Toyota teams or are mum about it. Rumors abound that have Yates, Rousch and other teams jumping to Toyota because big $$$ will buy them. I don't think that is the case but, I would also not doubt that there have been and still are efforts being made to get the major teams to change over....
My concerns are that the costs of competition will go up and up and tickets will become so expensive you'll need to take a second mortgage out in order to buy them. | 
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Oct 17th, 2006, 04:42 PM
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#22 | | Very Active Poster 50+
Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Titusville FL
Posts: 83 Model: 95 FLHT Interests: Motorcycle riding Occupation: Carpet Installer
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Originally Posted by CD It isn't that I do not like Toyota's or Honda's etc at all. It is the simple fact that between Honda and Toyota they have single handedly destroyed open wheel racing in America. CART nearly went under and IRL really should be called the HRL (Honda Racing League) since it is now the spec engine making the IRL more like a club circuit than a competitive organization. CART nearly went belly up completely and one of the causes was the money being dumped into the Honda engine program. The Craftsman truck series is turning into a Toyota benefit with Toyota winning nine of the last eighteen races. The problem I see is that the costs for every teams engine programs will go higher and higher due to the designed from scratch Toyota racing V8. NASCAR is slow to recognize and react to anything but debris calls when needed . Ford, Chevy and Dodge have all asked for an engine review program so that they could at least be on a level playing field and NASCAR has denied them. Rousch tested a truck series engine and it was within 30 HP of a cup car engine. Toyota's mouth piece Mikey the motor mouth Waltrip, claims that Toyota is not buying up talent yet, several drivers have either signed with future Toyota teams or are mum about it. Rumors abound that have Yates, Rousch and other teams jumping to Toyota because big $$$ will buy them. I don't think that is the case but, I would also not doubt that there have been and still are efforts being made to get the major teams to change over....
My concerns are that the costs of competition will go up and up and tickets will become so expensive you'll need to take a second mortgage out in order to buy them. | CD you are right and that is how Iam seeing it but as far as nascar Gm has always been the top dog and I think that they will do what ever it takes to stay that way | |
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Oct 17th, 2006, 05:21 PM
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#23 | | Administrator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 1,563 Interests: Fishing, wood working, flipping off Fred Fox Occupation: Founder of Bike Talk....retired and lovin' it
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Originally Posted by ridehard95 CD you are right and that is how Iam seeing it but as far as nascar Gm has always been the top dog and I think that they will do what ever it takes to stay that way | Perhaps, but with their economic issues it will most likely be more on the owners to do it than at the corporate level. GM has already cut back on it's R&D funding as has Ford. Dodge is still spending about the same. Toyota will spend whatever it takes in order to win. It won't matter who is top dog then 'cause the big money is behind Toyota.
Last edited by CD : Oct 18th, 2006 at 12:18 AM.
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Oct 17th, 2006, 08:42 PM
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#24 | | Moderator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 1,268 Model: 09 Ultra Classic, 01 Heritage Springer Interests: Motorcycles, camping, fishing, old cars Occupation: Home Inspector
| I think CD is correct and I to see Nascar becoming dominated by Toyota and Honda to. I fear we have seen the last of what Nascar is and was. This is also my last year watching it. I have heard that Dale Jarrett will be driving a Toyota next year.  | 
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Oct 18th, 2006, 06:14 AM
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#25 | | 200+ posts and climbing
Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Nomad, currently the Blue Ridge Mountains
Posts: 408 Model: 2006 FXDI SuperGlide Interests: Camping, fishing, admirer of beautiful women, fast motorcycles, and smooth whiskey Occupation: Writer illustrator
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Originally Posted by hotroadking FWIW you can't blame HD for the prices and the large number of people, it's not thier fault the market for the product exploded.
Go to a superbowl, a world series game, a college bowl game, NBA finals, any national event and this happens, Hotel Prices at Mardi Gras jump but hey it's not HD's Fault LOL
It's the nature of the beast, the closer you are to the event the more you pay, the better the seats the higher the price.
If you search hard enough you don't have to pay main street prices for beer, even on main street, you have to learn the system and what to buy.
been going for 10 years or more, have a good time, find my spot at the Ironhorse and drink my beer during free beer hour every afternoon
I can get a lot of beer with two mugs LOL
Ya just gotta know where to look and free concerts all over, good bands bad bands, half nekkid wimmen, whole nekkid wimmen, cool scoots, it just doesn't set me off as much, guess cause I dont' have to rent a room but hey that's the price of fame. |
Absolutely correct HRK and many old timers do the same thing, in many areas. I take my Grandkids to see American Legion League baseball because I can take them for a season for what taking them one time to a major league game costs. And at Myrtle Beach I was drinking 2.00 longnecks and eating free while the rubs were shelling out 3.50 and 4bucks a can. But because you can get around it don't make it right. Charging what a 6 pack costs and more for a can of beer bothers me....no matter who is paying for it. But bikers and sports fans never are willing to take a stand and make thier voice heard, for the most part. How long do you think ticket prices would stay as high as they do if there was just one "NO NFL Sunday"? The customer in the end has a lot to do with setting prices. Would I love to see such happen, sure. Do I think it will...not here not now. Most Americans are far to into instant gratification and too self centered to even be aware they are being bent over, let alone stand up, fight and yell rape!
Ride Free............. | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 07:48 AM
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#26 | | Rookie 10+ posts
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Waxhaw NC
Posts: 45 Interests: Riding and Saltwater Fishing
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I think the whole nascar thing could be a new discussion cd.
North Carolina Boy
Harleywyld1 | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 05:01 PM
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#27 | | Very Active Poster 50+
Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Titusville FL
Posts: 83 Model: 95 FLHT Interests: Motorcycle riding Occupation: Carpet Installer
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Originally Posted by GreyBear Absolutely correct HRK and many old timers do the same thing, in many areas. I take my Grandkids to see American Legion League baseball because I can take them for a season for what taking them one time to a major league game costs. And at Myrtle Beach I was drinking 2.00 longnecks and eating free while the rubs were shelling out 3.50 and 4bucks a can. But because you can get around it don't make it right. Charging what a 6 pack costs and more for a can of beer bothers me....no matter who is paying for it. But bikers and sports fans never are willing to take a stand and make their voice heard, for the most part. How long do you think ticket prices would stay as high as they do if there was just one "NO NFL Sunday"? The customer in the end has a lot to do with setting prices. Would I love to see such happen, sure. Do I think it will...not here not now. Most Americans are far to into instant gratification and too self centered to even be aware they are being bent over, let alone stand up, fight and yell rape!
Ride Free............. | You are right but the problem is that there are a hole new kind of bikers its called yuppie bikers that will spend what ever it takes to show every one they ride a HARLEY and have a leather coat and new chaps and $3000 dollars worth of bolt on garbage. It makes me sick when its 90 degrees out and these fools are walking around with there leather coat and chaps on with sweat running done there face. I guess bikers the way I was brought up are far and few.A biker is some thing that is in your soul and heart all the money in the world can't make you a biker | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 07:44 PM
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#28 | | 200+ posts and climbing
Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Nomad, currently the Blue Ridge Mountains
Posts: 408 Model: 2006 FXDI SuperGlide Interests: Camping, fishing, admirer of beautiful women, fast motorcycles, and smooth whiskey Occupation: Writer illustrator
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I am sitting here and having a revelation....reading a lot of this thread over and thinking about what the old timers must have felt a hundred years or so ago. Lot of similarities between the Viet Nam era men that became bikers and the Civil War (or as my Grandmother always referred to it: "that recent unpleasantness with the Yankees" <S>) era cowboys.They were lamenting the passing of an age as well. If I had myself a Ph.d I could probably get a grant to churn out a paper about that...as it is I will just pour myself another shot and do a bit of remembering.
You are right of course, ridehard95, the new guys can spend a ton of cash on the bling. But, they can't buy anything.....cause what they seek so desperately isn't for sale. Never has been, never will be.
Ride Free....... | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 07:48 PM
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#29 | | Moderator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 1,268 Model: 09 Ultra Classic, 01 Heritage Springer Interests: Motorcycles, camping, fishing, old cars Occupation: Home Inspector
| Shoot, of the nearly 500 members in our HOG chapter I'll bet that at least 75% are just ordinary hard working guys struggling like everyone else. Maybe in Florida and some other places but we just don't see the rubs here all that much. | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 08:11 PM
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#30 | | Has posted 500+
Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 804 Model: 2004 Yamaha FJR1300 Interests: riding... Occupation: RN
| I went on a "Ride For The Cure" charity ride for breast cancer in Aspen, CO a few years ago. Most were wearing all the brand new leather on their new looking HD's. My friend Kim calls em Zip Code riders..because they never ride outside their zip code. | |
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Oct 18th, 2006, 10:18 PM
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#31 | | Has posted 500+
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 838 Interests: Bikes, Boobs and Beer Occupation: Biker
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Zip code riders.... I like that one. Thanks. Now if I could only remember it tomorrow. | |
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Oct 19th, 2006, 01:35 PM
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#32 | | Rookie 10+ posts
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Waxhaw NC
Posts: 45 Interests: Riding and Saltwater Fishing
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Most of the local poker runs I ride in are mostly include actual bikers. A lot of these runs are put on by local clubs (jackets, patches) and that kind of keeps the posers away. Of course there is never any trouble but don't let them know that.
Now if you want to see something real scary come to the toys for tots run that is held in Charlotte each year. Chaos in motion. You have owners who have just finished a riding class and believe that they are now competent to ride in the middle of a group of 300-500 bikes. Oh yeah I forgot to mention that they are riding on the huge new bike they just bought when they finished the class and of course the bike they "learned to ride on" was a honda rebel. We havent even rode the route the last three years we just go to the final stop and turn in our toys and sit around and eat, drink and laugh. | |
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Oct 19th, 2006, 01:45 PM
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#33 | | Moderator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 1,268 Model: 09 Ultra Classic, 01 Heritage Springer Interests: Motorcycles, camping, fishing, old cars Occupation: Home Inspector
| When we have the Toy Run here in Portland on Dec 3rd its usually very cold or very wet or a combination of both. They will still get a couple thousand bikes to show up for the ride. Our Hog chapter always gets the honors of working with the Portland police to block roads.  That's the best way to participate in the run. Then after everyone has passed you simple head back over to the Harley shop for free food.  | |
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Oct 19th, 2006, 02:05 PM
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#34 | | Very Active Poster 50+
Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Titusville FL
Posts: 83 Model: 95 FLHT Interests: Motorcycle riding Occupation: Carpet Installer
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I don't go on poker runs for the simple reason that If I don't know you then don't ride beside me or behind me simple as that. I have seen fools run in the back of people or fall off at a stop sign and take the guy beside them down with them .Nope not for me when I ride with a group of guys I know every one of them and have road with them many times. Just to many biker want to be out there for me. I will just go off on my own and get there when I feel like it.Half these toy runs are bull sh#t any way the money never gets to where it is supposed to any way. I donate money to the vets I never went in to the military but I will never forget the folks that paid a price for my freedom and I am proud to be a American and hold high respect for the men and women that fight for our freedom and may god bless them and I thank them from the bottom of my heart. | |
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Oct 19th, 2006, 03:22 PM
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#35 | | Moderator Has posted 500+
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 1,268 Model: 09 Ultra Classic, 01 Heritage Springer Interests: Motorcycles, camping, fishing, old cars Occupation: Home Inspector
| No always the case there Richard. The toy run here generates thousands of dollars that yes are given to the Shiners hospital every year. Been to the ceremony. The proceeds from the sale of the donated new HD bike all go towards wheel chairs for the kids. Been there to and it will bring a grown man to tears seeing these kids getting their first wheel chair. No, I go every year donate my time and money as its for the kids not me. Plus its an excuse to get out of the house and meet up with old friends during the winter. | |
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Oct 19th, 2006, 04:23 PM
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#36 | | Very Active Poster 50+
Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Titusville FL
Posts: 83 Model: 95 FLHT Interests: Motorcycle riding Occupation: Carpet Installer
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Originally Posted by FLHTbiker No always the case there Richard. The toy run here generates thousands of dollars that yes are given to the Shiners hospital every year. Been to the ceremony. The proceeds from the sale of the donated new HD bike all go towards wheel chairs for the kids. Been there to and it will bring a grown man to tears seeing these kids getting their first wheel chair. No, I go every year donate my time and money as its for the kids not me. Plus its an excuse to get out of the house and meet up with old friends during the winter. | I am not saying all toy runs or poker runs are shady but there is a fair share that are. And as far as the Shiners I always go to our local eagles club and donate theres not a better feeling to see smiles on a kids faces. Put if you think all these bike runs are on the up and up think again. Some of these toy runs and poker runs are bull sh#t. If the money went where they say it was going to go that would be one thing but that is not always the case and if you think it is then I will sell you some ocean front property in Vermont.The biker world is changing and every one knows bikers spend money and they are alot of gold diggers that will gladly take your hard earn money for a 25 mile ride and a cheap door price. So Bikers beware make sure you know if its on the up and up. Money for kids is a great thing and I support that 100% . But I ain't paying for some scum bag to but a new pool in his back yard or a breast in plant for is old lady | |
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