1. After 20+ years it's time to pass the torch. If you are interested in acquiring this forum please contact support@cv-performance.com for details. Any spam will be reported and blocked.
  2. Welcome to Bike Talk, a forum for all bikers and motorcycle enthusiasts. If you are new to Bike Talk, be sure to register for free and join the conversation.

    There's always someone around willing to help out with questions or give a friendly wave back. All Harley and metric riders are welcome.

SE 255 Cams

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Tech Talk' started by Hazelnut, Nov 1, 2008.

  1. Hazelnut

    Hazelnut New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ohio
    Anyone running SE 255 cams in a stock 96 incher? I've been told that the extra .100 lift along with the low duration and small angle of intake closure really enhances low to midrange tork and power, great for touring bikes. It also seems that you can run the .560 lift without modifying the heads or changing the springs on 07 or 08 bikes. Any truth to this? Anyone with any input would be greatly apprecieated. Thanks
  2. Tomflhrci98

    Tomflhrci98 Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2004
    Messages:
    1,169
    Likes Received:
    17
    Location:
    So. Cal.
    Hey Hazelnut,

    I can’t answer your question directly, but I hate to see threads go unanswered and I’m bored today since it is raining.

    I am sure you will get an answer from someone soon so I thought I would ask you a question first.

    Since you are riding a touring bike, then typically you want a cam that gives you go low end performance. However, the Street Glide kind of has a bipolar complex since it looks like a bike you take to the dragstrip. Then after you’re done racing your buddies you pull out your lunch box and pass out cold beers.:rolleyes:

    So you have to tell us what kind of performance you want out of your FLHX, low end cruising torque for mother or a high end screamer.

    It’s just me throwing in my $0.02.
    Good luck,
    T
  3. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    the trick isn't just lift but timing of the lift.

    One of the best cams on the market not JMO but I've put it in and seen it work is Bobby Woods Wood Performance Carburetors - High Performance Harley Carbs and Cams new tw6-6 cam for 96 inch twin cams 07 and up.

    the cams design really helps the 96 tc wake up on the bottom to mid range,

    We put it in a stage 1 (filter and true dual) street glide. I did a little mapping with a twin scan and the SERT.

    The bike flys, he ran a stock 07 Ultra (stage 1 same filter and same pipes) and walked away, in no time the woods cammed bike was over 7 bike lengths ahead, only difference, the cam.

    this same bike has run with a new cvo110 and pulled on him from the bottom and held up to a hot 103.

    I'm amazed at this cam, all you need is the cam, some gaskets, locktite and HD SE timesaver pushrods.

    You can do this in an afternoon....

    For a good price call CAphil at California Phil's Concordia, KS (785) 243-9991 on woods cams.
  4. Hazelnut

    Hazelnut New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ohio
    Se 255

    Thanks guys sorry for the delay on the reply. I've been out of town for a while and haven't had a chance to reply to the help you have offered. My bike is an over the road bike that me and the wife like to trip on. With that been said throttle responce and torque are my number one objective with the weight of the bike, however I do like to romp around with my buddies and performance is a plus through the power band. I'll look into the woods cams it sounds like a good package since I already have Rinehardt true duals and a stage 2 air cleaner with a Power Commander and map that I purchased from Fuelmoto. I'm really happy with this package, but with winter coming on I'm going to be itching to get into my next project and may be searching for some map serts in the near future.
    Thanks guys,
    Hazelnut
  5. grandpa tom

    grandpa tom New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IND
    255 cams

    Hazelnut. I, like you, am looking for a bolt in cam for my Heritage. we ride mostly 2up so I want good low and take all I can get in the mid torque. Not really wanting high as very seldom over 5000 rpms, but dont want it to fall flat on its face if I do wind it higher.
    In my looking as said above the woods 6-6 or regular TW- 6 cam will outdo most other cams but with there quick ramps, some do complain of noise and a little more wear on valve assembly, so a person has to decide what the needs are.
    My son put SE204 in his 07 Duece and is totally happy. I am looking at the 204 along with Andrews 26, HQ tc500, S&S 510 and have just this week found info on the Crane 1-6000 Which is supposed to replace the HTC 300-2, Also the Crane 1-6001 or HTC 310 looks really good and just might be the one I pick..

    Most of the 255's are installed with the 103 kit and they work well in that build, but in the stock 96 I have read that with their 25* Intake close they are all done at 4k.

    Just food for thought.///
  6. 00 wildglide

    00 wildglide New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2005
    Messages:
    193
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    ca.
    Grandpa Tom,
    If you're looking at S.E.-204's,think about Andrews 37-h cams.510 lift,236int. duration & 240exh. duration.I have these cams in my '07-FLHTi with a Power commander III,Thunderheader & Arlen Ness big sucker a/c.,Dyno tune from RC cycles in Hayward Ca.The power band is excellent from start to freeway "roll-on" speeds.
    As fore mentioned,the valve timing of a cam choice really tells the story when true performance is desired.The Andrews 26h cams are o.k ,but feel like the torque drops off too soon.Probably great for 2up riding.Just my 2-cents,00 wildglide:cool:
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2009
  7. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2005
    Messages:
    10,512
    Likes Received:
    140
    Location:
    Las Vegas NV
  8. grandpa tom

    grandpa tom New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IND
    Having read and studied cams for a while, learned enough to be dangerous.
    the 37 in my opinion is fine for lighter bikes and single riders but for a FLSTC two up, I think the later intake closing is too much.
    I have been looking at the Crane 1-6000 for heavy bikes low to mid (o-5000) and the Crane 1-6001 mild street, mid low to mid - upper mid (1500-5500), cams.
    The intake close for the 6000 is 33 and 27 overlap which is a lot better than stock whereas the 6001 is 36 intake close and 35 O.L. puts it almost = with HQ-tc500 and almost the same as S&S and Dave Mackies 510 cam but they both have 38 IT close.
    If you take the Woods tw6-6 and add the + 4* you still get almost the same specs, so an article I read where almost all bolt in cams are close and equal to each other, I have to agree that they are but ;they are still not the same.
    So the game is still on, on trying to find the right cam for my use. I really dont think my desires are that much different than most other FLSTC (MIDWEIGHT)riders
    but after studying the cams profiles it hard to find one that fits what I call a perfect bolt-in cam....
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2009
  9. 00 wildglide

    00 wildglide New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2005
    Messages:
    193
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    ca.
    Grandpa Tom,
    Hope you find the cam you're looking for.I'm very happy with my set-up as it pulls hard & gives me the performance I was in search of.
    I think matching a cam to ones riding style is also a factor to keep in mind(JMO).:D
    Anyways,Good luck with your quest.00 wildglide:cool:
  10. Art_NJr

    Art_NJr New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    Messages:
    884
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Cam Timing

    I can't tell you which particular cams are best for any particular Big Twin application (I can for Sportsters/Buells), but I can tell you about the key timing factors. Once you've decided on the lift that's best for your setup, the 2 most important things to look @ are intake valve "closing event" & "overlap".

    Compression can't start to build until the intake valve has closed, so if you close it sooner, you'll get higher cylinder pressure. Doesn't change the mechanical compression ratio, but it does raise the effective CR & in some applications, causes "pinging". But if you close the intake too soon, you hurt top end power as the engine needs more mixture & it only gets enough to make power up to X rpm.

    The later you close the intake, the more top end power you'll get (up to a point), but @ the cost of low end power - it's always a compromise. Mixture velocity is a key factor here too - open the intake for a fairly short time, close it soon & the incoming mixture is moving really fast @ low rpms, which gives you gobs of low end torque. But then the engine runs out of breath on the top end. Open the intake sooner, close it later & mixture velocity slows down, which hurts the low end. But on the top end, where mixture is already moving fast, you get a lot more of it.

    "Overlap" is the time period between when the intake starts to open & the exhaust has closed (both valves partially open @ the same time) - the more overlap you've got, the more top end power you've got (up to a point). I'll use stock Sportster D cams as an example because the timing is symetrical & there's only 4 degrees of overlap - timing is 2/41 - 41/2. So just 2* before the piston hits top-dead-center on the exhaust stroke the intake starts to open & just 2* after TDC as the piston is starting down on the next intake stroke the exhaust valve has closed.

    There's a reason for that - to basically eliminate the effects of "reversion" - sound/pressure waves that come back up the exhaust pipe. With lots of overlap, reversion waves can come in the exhaust port, go thru the cylinder, out the intake port & into the intake manifold. On a carbureted engine, that really screws things up. Since we're dealing with an "odd-fire" engine, the reversion coming up the back pipe & front pipe hit the manifold @ irregular intervals & what you often see is one cyl. running rich while the other is running lean.

    But in one particular rpm range, reversion comes up, hits the exhaust port & back of the exhaust valve, then bounces back down the pipe just as the intake valve is opening, or while it's open. That not only helps pull exhaust out, but new mixture in @ the same time. But you can't make that happen idle to redline. And the exhaust system is crucial to making it work when you want it to.

    Some 2-1 systems are designed so that the engine thinks it's "even-fire" - the unequal-length front/rear pipes timing the exhaust pulses (going both ways) to hit every 360 degrees of flywheel rotation. But you can't make that happen idle to redline either & the range it works in is about 1500 rpm wide, typically 3000-4500 rpm (although you can move it). So if you pick cams that have the overlap working best in that range, you can really take advantage of it. Downside is you end up with a "peaky" engine - a real dog on the low end, then comes on with a surge of power, which fades away above 4500 rpm. But for highway riders who are running around 3000 rpm to begin with, want passing power without downshifting & don't want to rev to the sky, the setup is ideal. And with big-inch engines, there's enough low end torque that you can still take off from a stoplight fine.

    I always say think "system" instead of individual parts. You can pick cams that work best in the rpm range you normally ride in, but then pick an exhaust that works in another range & you end up losing power. I can't count the number of bikes where the owner spent well over $1000 on cams/exhaust & a stock bike will run off & hide from it. So you want to consider your riding style 1st, then look for parts which are designed to work together in that range. But remember that what you gain in one range you lose elsewhere.
  11. grandpa tom

    grandpa tom New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IND
    Art_NJR; As stated above I have learned enough to be dangerous, BUT You know enough that you can explain cams intelligently.
    Nice to know we have will informed personal aboard this forum...
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2009
  12. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    Why put a EPA cam back in yer bike. They run out of power too soon.

    I put a Woods TW6-6 cam in my bike and it rocks. I stayed with a chain drive too.
    Real close to puttin some stage II R&R heads on and some 95" JE pistons and cylinders that have been bored to make the compression 9.8.1.
    Waitin on Thundermax to release their tuner for the 08-09 bike.
  13. grandpa tom

    grandpa tom New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IND
    00:
    I went with the Andrews 26h because /Crane went out of business and I fumbled around too long to find any.
    I had them installed and got my bike back the 18th, this week.
    So far I am really happy with them, it dynoed at over 83 #tq between 2200-5000 rpm's and lines cross at 80, peak is 80/91, so for a stage 1 / bolt in cam I am really pleased.
    I'll post the stock base dyno sheet / and then after cam, and stage 1 dyno sheet for all to see.
    I drew in the red line in the 1st sheet because I had them done at 2 different places and couldn't do an overlay.
    Also I'll put in the final dnyo by itself so you all will know the red lines are real..

    I know these numbers are not the best I've seen but there are no dips and as you can see the gains are 15-20% over stock in the area where I ride, mostly 2200-5000 at the most. the seat of the pants feelng is great..aint no 100/110 but its plenty for this Grandpa!!!

    This is an 07 Heritage, Rush 2" slipons, SERT, K&N AC, andrews 26H

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 22, 2009
  14. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    Because Nebraska Sams was taken...
    LOL

    He's original from CA, moved family to KS while the kids grew up, cleaner, nicer environment...

Share This Page