1. After 20+ years it's time to pass the torch. If you are interested in acquiring this forum please contact support@cv-performance.com for details. Any spam will be reported and blocked.
  2. Welcome to Bike Talk, a forum for all bikers and motorcycle enthusiasts. If you are new to Bike Talk, be sure to register for free and join the conversation.

    There's always someone around willing to help out with questions or give a friendly wave back. All Harley and metric riders are welcome.

Starter went out

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Tech Talk' started by cardboard, Jul 19, 2010.

  1. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    a couple months ago, I got a 1.4 kw High Torgue starter from Spyke.
    I had a oil leak, changed my outter transmission gasket and inner primary and other gaskets.
    After puttin tranny fluid in the primary, I found the starter was leakin out the inner gasket.
    Sent the Spyke starter over a month ago back to Spyke.
    Was told the primary was vented out the starter and since I did a 103 build it increased the pressure in the primary and that is what is blowin the inner seal.
    Excuse me but I went from a 1.1 kw Nipidenso starter to a 1.4kw high torque starter.
    And with the engine compression going from a 9.2.1 to a 9.8.1 what pressure is blowing the inner seal.
    I've been on the phone with Wayne Greene at Spyke and I was told 8 working days ago today they would fix it with a couple days and I should have it last week.
    Called 2 times today and the starter is sittin on the supervisors desk and they are trying to figure out what to do with it.
    WTF.
    Can the folks in California not git it together. :gah:
  2. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    Just doesn't sound right

    All Balls Starters, buddy had one go Tango Uniform
    and in a week had a new one on the bench.

    Lifetime warranty, I'm interested though in your
    case as I got a Spyke on deal at Daytona (50% off)
    and it's in the old Heritage...
  3. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    I had looked at the Accel which has a heck of a lifetime warranty and a 5 yrs clutch warranty.
    What do you know about them.

    Superman from Spyke starters just called. He said they would have my starter to me by Wednesday and it will be guaranteed it won't leak .
    I'm glad to hear that.
    Thanks Superman.
    I'm gonna sit back with my fingers crossed.
    Then I will have to put it on and go test drive it.
  4. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    I"ve never heard of a starter leaking, there's no fluid in a them that I know of that would leak.

    I have heard of the starter seal leaking...
  5. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    I went with the Spyke starter cause I know a dude that has a indy shop that is real good with bikes and has had good luck with them.
    And I've seen folks in motorcycle mags use spykes stator in bike builds.
    I would just think if I'm building a product I could make it work right or not release it. But we have problems with products all the time. And who pays for it.

    Twist my arm.
    I was told that when I went from a 96cu engine to a 103cu that the pressure increased in the primary. 9.2.1 to 9.8.1 compression. That it increased the compression in the primary. guess it has something to do with torque. YOu tell me I can't understand . And if I went with a stronger clutch it could do it.
    Twist me arm.
    The primary is vented threw the starter. Really.
    Well the way the starter inner vent hole is made it allowd it to blow or leak fluid out the starter.
    I totally got lost, but i'm lookin to git it back, I was guaranteed it wouldn't leak and it has a year warranty.
    If it will make it a year , if it goes bad, I won't waste my time with it again.
    I've spent a lot of money and a lot of time, over 2 months jackin with this starter.
    I will probaly do as Hotrodking said go with a all balls starter next time.

    Mabe somebody could explain this to me and how the starter is vented and why it is leaking oil. then they could talk to Spyke and help them out too.
  6. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    There is an oil lube hole in the starter jackshaft area....

    For any oil to get from the engine through the primary and into the starter or for any pressure to get from the engine through the primary, and into the starter, would be nothing short of a miracle...

    YOu'd have to blow the seal off the mainshaft and then you'd back fill the primary with engine oil, then it'd have to get up to the top and go out the starter jackshaft, makes no sense, and it makes no sense that a larger 1 .4 w starter would have any issues with a mild 96 twinkie

    I ran the stock starter for 10 years on my softail it went through stock, mild
    wild 95 pushing over 205 psi per cyl with no comp releases, to a 116 SNS with wood 9bG to the current 124...

    I replaced it because I figured a larger starter would be good and it was a deal.

    Had more issues with the spyke blowing fuses (two or three) having to go through wires to clean it up, Frankly I should have left it alone LOL
  7. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    Thanks for the explanation.

    I asked Chucktx to explain it and he said bring a bottle of Jack and coke over.:D
    Now I can just keep the Jack in the freezer with Jim and make him come over here.:cussing:

    The high torque starter spins the 103cu motor on my bike faster makin it crank easier too.
  8. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    12,545
    Likes Received:
    10
    i think the seal was bad from the get go........and it internals in the starter were probably oil soaked........sure was throwin a lot of oil!!!!!!
  9. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    Yep!

    so much oil I was trippin out.
  10. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    IF the jackshaft seal was compromised during the install, then it's possible oil was coming out and flinging around, and that's right above the belt which will
    fling more oil...

    Use the newest HD jackshaft seal, put it in the freezer, no need to heat up the inner primary in this weather LOL....

    Be careful and put the jackshaft back in properly and don't cut the seal...

    Old seal design leaked...
  11. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    It don't have a jackshaft................
  12. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    then how's it turning the clutch and starting the engine...?
  13. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    The starter Abendix shaft shoots out and engages in the Ring Gear
  14. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    Was promised Monday that I would have the starter by Wednesday.
    Called Spyke today, they still have the starter. Been testing it to make sure it will not leak.
  15. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    The HD starter has a Bendix extension shaft, it pushes the starter Jack-shaft which is a multi-piece o crap that can bind LOL into the primary and it turns the clutch basket gear and then the engine to start it..

    All Balls sells a one piece jackshaft which I've put on the 124 and on Dougs 113, we found the stock HD stuff was a PIA, you can eliminate 4 parts in that equation going to the single piece jackshaft.

    Not that you need to, I think we're discussing two different parts.

    BTW the starter bendix gear is inside a coupler that mates to the jackshaft, and this is behind the inner primary, it doesn't protrude past the inner primary seal.

    So for oil to come out of the inner primary, get on the coupler and bendix shaft it would have to be leaking at the seal..

    So be careful, replace the seal (freeze it first for an hour or more) then let it warm up and expand and put the starter jackshaft through it. Be careful not to nick that seal or
    you'll be leaking again...
  16. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    I know that I'm terrible at explainin things


    The starter clutch engages into the pinion gear which engages in the ring gear.
    On the newer bikes they eliminated the jackshaft that is the extension I think yer talkin about that engages on the 06 and below bikes into the ring gear.

    http://www.jpcycles.com/search/search?Context=0&Ntt=starter jackshaft&Ntk=All&x=16&y=12

    The newer bikes does not have this jackshaft extension. But i'm sure you already know that.:D

    [​IMG]
  17. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    havent messed with that on the 09 yet... Will have to read the manual..

    This weekend will be new cams, woods +4 gear and 106 cyl and pistons
    then back to tuning the TTS...
  18. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    12,545
    Likes Received:
    10
    fun, fun fun!!!!!!!!!:D
  19. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    11,459
    Likes Received:
    56
    Location:
    Lake Livingston, Tx.
    Can't believe it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Peter Mann from Spyke overnited me a starter.

    Gonna go downstairs in a little while and stick it in and see if it leaks..:D
  20. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    13,682
    Likes Received:
    584
    Location:
    Mouseville USA
    kool, be sure to use locktite on the bolts and that all the fluids are in...

    the primary...

Share This Page