Cams

hello im new to this site hoping to get some help with my bike. ive got an 05 night train with 88tc thats very slow. can i add some cams pipe carb air filter and get a good jump? i dont want to convert it to 96. can i do the cams in my drive way

Yes you can do it in the driveway but changing cams would not be wise. "Paying the Harley Tax" involves a freer-flowing air-cleaner, quality slip-on mufflers & rejetting the carb so the engine can breathe, but cams are always a compromise - you must give up one thing to get another. As many bad things that may be said about the MOCO, their knowledge of cam timing ain't one & unless you want to target a given rpm range & know all about lift, duration, intake opening/closing, exhaust opening/closing, overlap, etc., cams you do not want to mess with.

i understand that cams can really get messy but i would go to shop to get the right size for my app. i just want to be able to work on my own bike. and i would be switching to a gear drive set up. do still think its a bad idea? and whats moco?

The stock cams work quite well in most "daily driver" applications & "MOCO" refers to the "Motor Company" - Harley-Davidson. The gear-drive setup is definitely better, but to get an engine to run right for a given application, you MUST think "system" rather than individual parts. There's more power to be found in the heads than anywhere else & given the choice of spending $$$ on cams or headwork, I'll take the headwork every time.

Aftermarket cams are usually designed for more top-end HP, but cams are always a compromise & to get more top-end HP you have to give away low-rpm torque. And the more you go with increased lift, duration & overlap, the narrower your powerband gets. For example, my 1650 Sportster race engine makes 167 HP @ 7200 rpm, but if I were to set the rev-limiters @ 4500 rpm, my 883 Sportster would beat the race bike.

Throwing things like "hotter" cams, the biggest carb with the "fattest" jets, etc. on didn't work 40 years ago & truly I'm amazed to see it promoted now. Your 88" TC will come apart before you can use "hot" cams & the valvetrain is one reason why - the pushrods running @ wierd angles will bend. Not might, will. Wonder why pro big twin racers use a 4-cam Sportster type setup ?

You'll get more useable power from tuning the engine you've got with intake & exhaust tweaks than by thowing cams in it & it'll last a heck of a lot longer too. Harleys love the mid-range (3000-5000 rpm) & it just makes sense to me to use it on the street/road/highway. You don't want to know what it costs to pull 7200 rpm for 3 miles, believe me. And you can't do it with a TC88.

so could you give me a tool list? and since i live in me. and winter down time is the time ill be doing the work i dont have to spend 3500 on a 95 inch kit? i can just bore out my jugs? but i would like to keep it 88 can i get say 80 to 100 horse with good tourqe out of 88? i dont really go fast for long, im more of a light to light guy. pull real hard for an eighth mile or so.

im not looking to get all drag race ready, it is my daily driver bike. howerver i do want power from stop to stop. huge cams and huge carbs are not what im looking for. im looking for good reliable power in an 88 inch shell. i am mechaniclly inclined enough to know that the biggest cam isnt gonna give me the best power. now the head work you speak of what would that consist of? port polish bigger valves?....

No, not bigger valves & definitely not polished intake ports. Just find the bigger of the 2 intake ports, clean that one up & make the other one match. Then do the same with the exhaust ports. Then make the combustion chambers in the heads match - find the larger of the 2, clean it up & make the other one match.

You've got an "undersquare" engine (stroke is longer than the bore is wide) which will not rev very high, but will make gobs of torque in the rpm range you actually use & that's what you want to go for IMO. Bigger valves & more cam just target a higher rpm range you will probably never use on the street/road & will seriously hurt lower rpm torque.

ok so how would i find the bigger of the two? and im assuming its not work that i can do myself so roughly how much am i looking at cash wise...it makes perfect sense to me to do head work before cam work. and will i be able to make 80 to 100 horse with good tourqe safely out of my 88?

Yes, you can get that power from a TC88 without going crazy & while you can get micrometers to measure with & work on the heads with tools like a die-grinder in your garage, you'll spend more time & money trying to get it right than by just sending the heads out. Shops like ECS Engineering here in North Carolina, Zippers in Maryland, NRHS in Colorado, HeadQuarters in Michigan & Ontario, Canada & CycleRama in Florida do professional head work on Harleys all the time & they're very good @ it. You'd have to call the one closest to you to see what the prices are, including shipping back & forth, but it's really not all that expensive to have the heads cleaned up & it'd be a good idea to send the intake manifold too so it can be matched up to the intake ports.

No doubt there are a lot of other good shops too, I just mention those 'cause I know about 'em - haven't dealt with CycleRama directly, but I have seen Wes Brown's head work, I have a set of heads done by Zippers, another set done by HeadQuarters, I've been to NRHS, know the owner & ECS is a local shop I know the owner of too. To me it's one of those deals where you don't call an electrician when you need a plumber I can run a milling machine, lathe, etc., but don't own such equipment, so I go to the folks who do, since I don't work for a co. which has all that equp. anymore. Tell any of those shops what it is you want to accomplish & they'll do it right the 1st time.

and that makes perfect sense... thank for the help! do happen to know of any in the maine, new hampshire region? or can i call these places and have them sent?

hey man thanks alot for the help...im 29 years old and done alot of @#$%in off with my cash, now im smarter an need to play catch up in the learning region with motor tech....first harley wont be the last but even the guys that get $70 dollars an hour for this stuff had to start somewere right? ill keep yah updated...

One other thing I think goes hand in hand the the Service manual is the Parts Catalog. It has all part numbers and diagrams with the order of assembly.

No, I don't personally know of shops in your region, but any of the ones I mentioned will handle the work if you send the parts to 'em. The'll send 'em back ready to install & will give you a lot of information over the phone before you even start.

i actually talked to a woman at bishops. i cant remember her name but she was telling me for around 15 to 1700 i could have my work done and get my cams for the big bore. very helpful place and i will be doing that this winter. she also talked me ouy of buying an s&s she said that the stock cv works fine. i can get it bored out to 42 or leave it stock. i can also run my stock cams and get decent power....who new my quest for 100 reliable non exploding horse is starting to come to an end......thanks again!!