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Help needed on clacking sound carb

Discussion in 'CVP Stage 1 Tuners Kit' started by Harlock, Jul 27, 2012.

  1. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Hi there

    I have a problem with the carb after doing the Stage 1 upgrade.
    Bike is FLSTC 1999 and have currently 46-185 setup.

    The carb makes a "clacking" sound just off idle.

    Here's a avi file with sound ;-) ... sometimes it's easier to just show the problem than describe it ...

    ==Link deleted, possible adware from that download site==
    Please zip and send the avi file to the sender email address that sent you your order confirmation.


    Just make sure you click the "download" not the "download" or "play" with the arrow.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 27, 2012
    Harlock, Jul 27, 2012
    #1
  3. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

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    Unfortunately I can't/won't download from that site since it tries to load adware to my computer.

    Any clack or similar sound just off idle sounds like a loose part inside the slide assembly or maybe the emulsion tube has come loose. I would suggest removing the top and slide to make sure nothing is rattling around inside there. The spring should be kept in place by the plastic retainer which then has the spring placed over it. If the previous install used shims or washer around the needle, make sure those are not used with this kit.
    kenfuzed, Jul 27, 2012
    #2
  4. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Some carbs and cam combos will clack, the Mikuni is famous for this sound with the metal one piece slide, get the cam profile just right and the way the engine pulls air in will cause a clackity clack sound.

    Might be similar for you if you have changed pipes or cams or both...
    hotroadking, Jul 27, 2012
    #3
  5. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    You need to click the other download (without the arrow) .. file sharing is annoying :cussing:

    I'll send the avi file right away to the address mentioned ...

    Message sent (it's a mp4 file from my iphone)
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2012
    Harlock, Jul 27, 2012
    #4
  6. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

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    Received your email and avi file. Sounds like a lean pop causing that noise. I explain more in that email but basically you would want to turn the mixture screw outward 1/8th of a turn at a time until there is no more lean pop. If reaching 4 turns, move up one size on your pilot jet. If however you are already using the largest pilot jet in that kit then you may have a vacuum leak at the manifold boot which your jetting is trying to compensate for.
    kenfuzed, Jul 27, 2012
    #5
  7. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Ken

    Thx for the tip. I was between 2 and 3 turns out. Will set it out a bit more to see what happens.

    Ive just done another test: have taken the air filter off to get a visual and without it I get no clacking.
    Put the filter back on and clacking comes back. Not enough air flow ?
    Harlock, Jul 27, 2012
    #6
  8. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Might be that the cover and filter are covering other sounds when on and you notice it more.
    hotroadking, Jul 27, 2012
    #7
  9. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Ken ... I tried to turn the mixture screw up ... went up to 4 turns but the problem is still there. (although maybe (just maybe) less pronounced).
    I'm using 46 and 185 ... I am coming from a 42-200.

    HRK ... Nope sound is definitely there and very pronounced. I'd hear that without the filter as well for sure ...


    Additional info:
    * When I open the choke it looks like it doesn't do that sound anymore.
    * Also when I let it idle for a longer period of time I get a "puff" and the bike stops.
    * Its almost impossible to start it back again. I can try 10 times without success. I'd almost swear that when I open the choke again it starts easier
    * I also sometimes see a bit of smoke coming out of the carb as well and hear "an exploding sound"

    Now I'm not sure ... does it get too much air or not enough ? Or too much gas or not enough ?
    I feel lost.:confused:
    I hope this makes sense to someone ...
    Harlock, Jul 31, 2012
    #8
  10. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Then

    You sure it's clacking from the carb...
    hotroadking, Jul 31, 2012
    #9
  11. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Hahaha ... I see the point ... but Air filter ?
    Harlock, Jul 31, 2012
    #10
  12. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

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    If it still sounds like the sound file you sent me I would still say you are too lean, possibly either a vacuum leak or a clogged mixture passage.
    See #3 in this [PAGE="http://bike-talk.com/forum/cvp-stage-1-tuners-kit/16628-faq-carburetor-tuning-issues.html"]tuning issues article[/PAGE].

    The fact that pulling the choke out makes the sound stop tells me you are too lean. The choke on these carburetors are actually an enrichener that adds fuel to the mixture when pulled out. If the problem were mechanical (loose hardware, worn parts) the sound would not go away based on only adding fuel.
    kenfuzed, Jul 31, 2012
    #11
  13. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Another update:

    I've removed the carb and cleaned it thoroughly. Made sure the air was flowing everywhere, removed the jest and mixture screw and cleaned the air passages there as well.

    Reinstalled the whole thing but now the carb is breathing fire.
    Send another video file (with air cleaner removed). The suddenly it went dead and that's about it.

    Problem is it just went dead and I can't get it to start. Opened choke and set screw out on 3 turns, closed choke, opened gas, ... nothing helps. I just can't get the bike to start again.

    Cleaned the plugs (looked dry black - probably due to the choke usage).
    Still nothing.

    Please Help I can't get a grip on it anymore.
    Harlock, Aug 3, 2012
    #12
  14. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    check the vacuum line from the carb to the petcock
    if you have a stock Hd petcock the line must be in place and
    properly installed or it won't flow fuel.
    hotroadking, Aug 3, 2012
    #13
  15. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Hi HRK

    Checked ... looks OK to me ... It's spraying when I twist the throttle ...
    Harlock, Aug 3, 2012
    #14
  16. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

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    Breathing fire? Probably an excess of fuel sent to the combustion chamber that ignited.

    A couple of things to check regarding the no start condition. Not knowing what has or hasn't been checked I'm just throwing out there everything I would normally check. Before testing be sure to have a charger available to keep the battery fully charged between cranking.
    1. Spark - make sure that you have spark to each plug as the engine cranks. Remove one plug wire at a time and connect to a grounded spare plug. No or weak spark indicates an ignition system problem.
    2. Fuel delivery - Twisting the throttle with the engine off you should see a momentary spray of fuel come from the accelerator pump nozzle. This also requires that the bowl be filled with fuel (see #3).
    3. Fuel in the bowl - removing the bowl it should be at least half full. Check that the float valve has not become stuck in either the open or closed position.
    4. Fuel delivery from the tank and petcock. If you suspect fuel is not getting to the carburetor, remove the fuel line from the carburetor and place in a can. Crank the engine, the vacuum signal from the carburetor to the petcock will open valve allowing fuel to flow out the hose. It should cease when the engine stops cranking.
    5. Proper vacuum hose routing - check that the vacuum hoses are correctly connected to the petcock (if equipped) and/or VOES switch, assuming you have the EVO 1340 model and not a Twin Cam model.
    kenfuzed, Aug 3, 2012
    #15
  17. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    Will go by them one by one ...
    After HRK mentioned the fuel line he got me thinking there as well. (Thanks HRK)

    1.> Replaced the Spark Plugs
    2.> Accelerator works but HRK made me think and I added new fule (old one hasn't been there for more than 3 months but I figured what the hell (almost feel like a noob here - should've though about that sooner too)
    3.> Will have to check that when I remove the Carb ... last time there was fuel in the chamber
    4.> Good tip ... will try that one in the morning
    5.> VOES worked last time but I'm not taking chances anymore ... will recheck as well (it's an 1340EVO all right :D )

    I appreciate all the things you throw at me ...

    Small update: after cleaning the new plugs (again) and re adding fresh fuel I got it to turn for a moment and fuel starter to flow through the carb. Unfortunately the battery was getting weak so it looks like I won't be getting any new sparks until the morning :gah: Charger will be doing it's work now.
    Looked like the "coughing" was back but I'll need to run the engine a bit more to get it spread everywhere and give it the benefit of the doubt for now.

    Will continue tomorrow for sure ... it's getting personal with my bike now... by tomorrow we'll be on first name base again ...

    Of course I'll update with news.
    Harlock, Aug 3, 2012
    #16
  18. Harlock

    Harlock New Member

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    UPDATE
    I get th ebike to start now (no problem when on Enrichener)
    So we're back to the beginning.

    Coughing is same as it was. I tried changing the jet to the stock 42 I had and of course that didn't work. Then I put the 200 Main Jet back instead of the 185 and had a bigger problem there:

    when cranking the engine it kind of blew up ! I mean the carb started to breathe fumes and the next thing I knew the oil explored from the oil tank. I was lucky it was warm but not hot as it covered me head to waist. The oil cap flew a couple of inches from my face. The pressure must have been huge.

    After a 2 hour cleaning of the oil in my garage it got me thinking if the problem wouldn't be in the ignition part ? Isn't it something that would happen when the timing would be off ?

    Anyway I never experienced something like that before and got mad and called the local Harley dealer to pick the bike up. I really am at the end of my abilities now. Don't even know where to start.
    Harlock, Aug 4, 2012
    #17
  19. kenfuzed

    kenfuzed Administrator Staff Member

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    After hearing about the oil blowing out through the tank I think there is an ignition or timing issue. The carburetor no matter how jetted will typically not cause a problem as severe as kicking oil out since its function is to supply a mixture of air/fuel. Therefore at worst the carburetor would either deliver a mixture that is too lean or too rich.

    I've seen a bike with a bad valve that allowed the ignited mixture to blow back out the intake, but I don't want to make that assumption.
    kenfuzed, Aug 5, 2012
    #18

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