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Replacing cam shaft bearings

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Tech Talk' started by stoogefan, Aug 21, 2008.

  1. stoogefan

    stoogefan New Member

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    i have a 2000 ultra-classic that started making noises. i was told that it was the cam shaft bearings. any help on how much it will cost and how difficult of a job??? thanks, stoogefan
  2. mwelych

    mwelych Active Member

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    Depending on the parts you purchase and if you are doing it yourself, you can look at around 150-250 bucks. Now if a tech is doing it way more...:)
  3. duke76

    duke76 New Member

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    well, if it is indeed camshaft bearings and you do the work yourself it will cost next to nothing. You will need two torrington b-148 bearings, around 5-6 bucks a piece and a camcover gasket and some o rings for the oil pump, Do not replace the bearings with HD INA ones because they have a cage between them are are prone to come apart, I changed cams at 25 k and bearings were toast, I dont know how many miles you have but tensioners crap out between 20 to 60 K so that could also be your noise, and as long as you are in it this far you may as well put in some aftermarket cams and possibly switch to gear drive or Andrews roller conversion. Todd
  4. duke76

    duke76 New Member

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    I forgot that the torrington b-148 are the inner bearings, they are usually the ones that go bad except for in 99 then they were the outer ones, Todd
  5. duke76

    duke76 New Member

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    I just did some research and found out that some 2000 models are also included. better just take off the cam cover and take a look, Todd
  6. Sleepy

    Sleepy Well-Known Member

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    If you haven't checked out the tensioners yet you probably should. My buddy's bike, a 2000 with 50000 miles had the tensioners go, he waited a little too long and it cost him a new motor. I bought the extended warranty with my bike, a 2004 E G. [ Some say it's a bad deal and if I had the talent that a good number of you guys here have and the time, a bigger problem for me, I'd tackle more if this stuff on my own and will do so.] The bike has 45000 kilometers used Syn 3 from the get go, the fluids have been changed religiously..[that I make the time for] and the tensioners were half worn out so they got replaced, cam bearings etc under warranty. I'll give the cover a pull in 20000 kilometers to see how this set holds up.
  7. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    If you're going to do this yourself get the Service Manual before proceeding past cam cover removal.

    There are two things that typically go wrong in the cam chest

    1) Bearings, two in cam plate (original HD design 99 and early 00s') the rear bearing needed to be replaced due to the type of bearing with cage failing, and two in the case. If you are this far in replace all four

    (Tools, bearing removal tool for bearings in chest, press with enough pressure to get cams out of bearings from cam plate, press in new bearings in cam plate and tool to put bearings in case properly.)

    2) Tensioner shoes, HD used a super strong tensioner spring which JMO was the problem, the new 06 and up have a hydraulic light spring tensioner.

    (Tools, tensoner tool to take pressure off chains, or a big flat screwdriver and a pin to lock the tensioner in place plus a Jesus clip removal tool (As in "Jesus christ where'd the heLL'd that clip go)

    First thing I'd do is Inspect the cam chest visually for damage and broken parts:

    You need to drop the front exhaust, floorboard and cam cover, be ready for oil to come out so put the pan under it and some rags on the frame and do an inspection.

    The two tensioners are orange plastic shoes on arms one in front and one in back, you obviously can see the front one, the back probably not. If it is still there it's probably worn half way though, they may be completely gone and the tensioner arm running on the chains. If they are gone and it's running on the chain this might be your problem.

    If you want to go farther into the cam chest it's not complicated but its a bit more expensive and time consuming than just bearings and a gasket.

    You need to remove the pushrods to take the tension off the tappets and cams, also you need to align the cams so it's at TDC. (Assuming you may or may not know what that is.

    (Tools: something to hold up lifters, bolt cutters if you cut the pusrods out and replace with HD Time Saver Pushrods)

    With an 00 I would absolutely replace all the lifters, the designed changed after 00 and the new "b" meaning the suffix on the lifter PN from HD are very good and the ones you want.

    There are some cam bearing puller and press tools, you'll need a press to put the bearings in the cam plate, or, freeze the bearings for a couple of hours, then heat the cam plate lightly around the bearing surface, pull out a frozen bearing and drop it in, should fall right into the hole in the cam plate.

    Although you will still need to press the cams into the bearings, so you could freeze the cams and lightly heat the inner race of the bearing but thats risking the bearing.

    If you don't have the proper tools to support the bearing races inner race then I'd take the cam plate to a shop to press in for you.

    You need the SM, and the parts manual, make a list of the parts, get them all and then see if you have the tools to do the job.

    You will also have oil pump o-rings to replace, and you need to know how to align the oil pump properly or you'll end up with oil blowby which happens on extended higher speed runs (70 to 80 mph) you need evo tappet block alignment tools or you need to know how to do it without them.

    Anyway I didn't want it to sound like you took the cover off and replaced a light bulb, but it's not rocket science either, knowing what to do and having the tools makes it easier. If you have a friend that's done this all the better to buy him a steak and beer and cigar or whatever it takes to get help.

    Otherwise, hate to say it but if you're not comfortable, write the check and I agree, drop in a set of mild stree cams, why the heck not, you've spent the money on parts and labor to get this far, you're just a set of cams away.

    On a stock 88 in my favorite order

    Woods W-6 more tq faster better than the rest
    SNS 510
    Andrews tw26
    SE 204

    Ok now that the cams are out, you do know you're just a few bolts away from a 95 inch motor, ok first you............
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2008
  8. stoogefan

    stoogefan New Member

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    thanks

    thanks for all the info especially from you hotroadking. i might try it wish me luck stoogefan
  9. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

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    hrk is good info!!!!! and remember, were here if ya need some help. :)
  10. Breeze

    Breeze New Member

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    Cam Bearings

    HRK pretty much nailed it. I've known several folks that jumped into a "bolt-on" project only to find out they needed special tools, press, etc. You can do this and save the $$$ that the stealer charges... just be sure you have everything to do it with and get familiar with the procedure in advance.

    You can eliminate problems with the cam chain tensioners by converting to gear drive. Cost a few more bucks but also provides more precise valve timing.

    FYI: When I need access to a press, I go to the local NAPA parts house and use theirs. They only charge me a few bucks for it.
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2008
  11. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    HRK, Is the 06-up hyd light spring tensioner able to be retro fitted in place of that too strong tensioner on the earlier models??
    I've seen inside a few of camchests on the TC's lately and its pretty much a given when they're open up the shoes need to be replaced and they're not all that high milage.
    The last one has about 40K hard miles on and the shoes were worn almost completely thru on the inner chain,outer was worn but not as deep.

    Great Post, BTW. Almost don't need the SM with those instructions:)
  12. ringo912

    ringo912 Active Member

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    Hey Lucifer...if ya go to the above post titled Assembly Lube, I posted a link that will explain the conversion to hydraulic tensioner shoes. Hope this helps. :cool:
  13. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Thanks,ringo... All the info I was looking for. A link is worth 1000 words:roflmao:.
    It's for future reference, I'm tryin real hard not to touch my TC,except for gen maintenance. 19K on it now so I'll prolly wait until 25K on it. When it does get opened I'll prolly do the conversion+ cams,lifters........
  14. ringo912

    ringo912 Active Member

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    Always glad to help the cause Lucifer. If ya decide to go with the gears when you make the change, let me know. I did my own and will be happy to help with any info you might need! :cool:
  15. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes and no, Yes you can put it in the older cases, no you can't retrofit it to the existing cam plate, you'd need the new cam plate, then you'll need new 06 (dyna only in 06) and up cams.

    the new cam plate has no rotating bearings, they are the same as the machined bearings in a crankcase on a car. The cam ends float in oil. Much easier and nicer than the old stuff but you will be replacing everything, if you are going to upgrade cams from stock then you might consider it. Otherwise it's cheaper to polish the outside edge of cam chains and put in new tensioner pads or go gear drive.

    BTW the newer HD motors have more "acceptable" runout at the crank making gear driven cams almost impossible. With the new chain system it's not really that big a problem.
  16. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Thanks HRK, Thats what I'll be doing,when its time to replace the shoes and put in the W-6,everything will be replaced. Nicer and easier....I like the sound of that.

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