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Blood, sweat, tears & beers . . .

Discussion in 'Pull up a chair and sit for a spell' started by joshbob, Apr 6, 2011.

  1. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

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    i wouldnt install the "oil collector gizmo" until i cured the problem....i know ya said the pump is leaking, but where is the majority of the oil comming from??
  2. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Most of it is coming from the breather - about a 2" or so puddle drips out of the hose when I crank it several times. I have no idea why it's doing it - maybe it's normal? Please don't tell me I need another oil pump.
  3. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    So it's a lot less oil coming from the breather now than at first...and you've got a leaky oil pump....My guess is the tank was over filled a bit and your kickin is pumping it out and the leaky pump isn't scavenging properly...so when you fix the leaky pump(I highly doubt you'll need a new one,just a gasket kit) and get the bike fired up, you'll be fine....don't waste your money on that band-aid gizmo....put a pan under your breather to collect the oil and you'll probably find it's not much....always looks like a lot when it's spilled on a floor....
  4. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah, since you said to fill it with 2 1/2 quarts, I just took a half quart out and it's much better. I'm going to try the gasket route first, like you said, and see what happens.
    In the meantime, in other news today . . . me and a mechanic friend of mine tried to get the Beast to start. He's not a bike mechanic, but offered to help. First thing I did was check for spark at the wires and we got spark. We used this gizmo that you attach to the spark plug and plug into the wire and a orange light comes on whenever it fires. Then I checked to see if the gas is shooting into the carb and we got lots of gas. Only thing left is the ignition timing. I've been messing with it for days now. We went through everything the manual says to do, double checking along the way - still no dice. I don't get it. The first time I kicked it after all the adjustments, I heard that deep thumping sound, like something might happen - after that I kicked my brains out and nothing. We have compression, spark, gas, plugs gapped, points set - WTF?
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2011
  5. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

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    try this................with engine cold,and not having tried to start it earlier.....like let it set overnite...............with key off, choke on, gas on, kick it through twice. with key on, half choke, no throttle applied, kick it like ya mean it!!!!..........i think maybe your flooding it..........
  6. cowboy

    cowboy Moderator Staff Member

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    That's what it sound s like if you have put rocks in your pocket when you kick it :) it will run good just don't rev it up to fast
  7. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Okay, I'll try that this morning when I go out to the shop. Trust me, I've been kicking it like I mean it for days now, no rocks needed!
    The routine I've been using up till now was: no key, turn on gas, full choke, twist throttle several times, kick twice. Then, turn key on, still full choke, twist throttle once or twice again & kick on compression stroke. After not starting after 4, 5 compression kicks, twist throttle again once or twice and commence kicking. Does sound like too much gas, now that I think about it . . . also when I gave it gas, I would twist the throttle all the way open every time. Holy cow! This must be it! But first, breakfast, chores, and the morning walk with Radar.

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  8. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Tried it this morning and still she no start. Thinking of calling the Harley dealer and see if I can get them to look it over - but first I'll have to have a pocket full of jingles.:witsend: Harley won't take rocks!
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2011
  9. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    What about your local Indy???...You'd be lucky to have someone at a dealership knows what a Shovel is let alone find a problem with one...IMO
  10. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    yep I'd agree
    ask if they have experience with kickers...

    Also part of the problem could be a really tight
    engine, depending on how it was put back together
    getting oil to the rings, getting it broken in,

    It might really be needed some oomph and multiple attempts


    If you have spark, and you have fuel (not too much)
    and you have compression (presuming you have done a compression test) then it's possible timing is off, you might try moving the timing just a bit to try a different setting.
  11. HarleysLR

    HarleysLR Active Member

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    could still be flooded with all the twist that's it's been given. How do plugs look wet , dry or ?? What you need is one of those roller to put the rear wheel and car wheel on and turn it over that way.
  12. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    I'm wondering if I messed up the coil when I had it hooked up wrong a little while back. I was testing to see how my lights would work (ignition on for 10 minutes or so) and noticed the coil was very hot - too hot to touch. Could I have buggered it? And it's a used coil, too. I can get an ohm meter from my mechanic friend and check to see how much output I have on the coil, but not until Monday. I know I'm getting SOME spark as we tested it with a spark plug wire test light - but how much, I don't know. Couldn't it be possible there might not be enough spark to jump the plug gap?
    As far as compression: I tried my friend's compression tester but the thing wouldn't work at all. We tested it on another motor to make sure and sure enough, it didn't work. So, the only "compression" test we did was take the plugs out and hold a thumb over the hole and "feel" the pressure. I could feel the suction on the down stroke, too. I know I'm going to have to do a real test but I must wait until pay day to buy a tester - next week. Manual says 90 psi or so with no more than 30 psi differential between cylinders.
    Today I ordered a gasket for the oil pump cover & a plastic view plug for the inspection hole from J&P. Had to - nobody else had a gasket. So it's still a waiting game, but I suppose that's okay; my right thigh is so sore from kicking I can't hardly kick anymore and my legs are in good shape for a geezer: I walk several miles every day and do calf lifts and knee bends, too, besides upper body workouts. But I need to take some time off from kicking to heal up . . . kicking angle of pedal arm is between 9 and 11 o'clock when I begin the kick - usually around 10 o'clock, so I think I'm getting enough "oomph" behind it. This motorcycle should have started a long time ago . . .
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2011
  13. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    I burned my bridge with him - treated me like s*** the last time I went to see him. I loaded my bike on the truck and drove out to get the brake parts I needed from him. Plus he said he wanted to see the bike. He was so "busy" when I came in, he wouldn't even come out and look at the bike. He picked a bad day to have a bad day. He has told me he hates shovelheads even though he works on them at times. I don't want anybody with that kind of an attitude working on my scooter, anyway. Far as I'm concerned, he's a p****. The next nearest indie is over a hundred miles away.
    When Tattoo Tony gets back in town next week, I'll try to get him to look at it if I haven't gotten it started by then.
    And thanks everybody for your suggestions & help!
  14. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    That's too bad....sucks when they have an attitude like that...Tattoo Tony was the guy I was thinking of...thought he was an Indy...hopefully you'll have her running by then...
  15. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, Tattoo Tony is the man. He has a late '60's kidney side shovel custom. He just recently opened a little small engine repair shop in Tarboro and works on bikes, 4 wheelers, motor scooters, lawn mowers, weed eaters or whatever comes in. Last time I was in his shop, there was maybe a dozen bikes in there. I guess you could say he's an indie, and only 15 miles away, too. I will be patient and await his return from Georgia next week. Here's his card:

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    Last edited: Aug 6, 2011
  16. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

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    if you are getting a nice blue spark at the plug, i say the coil is ok.........
  17. chucktx

    chucktx Moderator Staff Member

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    i have done this, but dont recomend it....... have some one in a car pull you. hold the rope in your hand, dont tie it off to anything, get up some speed slowly, 25 or so, let the rope go, have the key, and gas on........pull clutch and bang 2nd gear and bounce on the seat hard at the same time.......may have to do it a couple times......be easy on the throttle tho.........
  18. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    I'm not quite that desperate yet, Chuck! I don't think I'm gonna try that; sounds kinda scary. Now about the "blue spark". I tested each wire with a nail in the end of each one and cranked the bike with a socket until spark was obtained, holding the nail a 1/4" from the head. It says to do this in the manual. Here are the exact words: TURN ON THE IGNITION, BREAK THE POINTS BY HAND. (I broke the points by turning the crank) SEE IF A 'HOT' OR BLUE SPARK IS OBTAINED. IF NOT, IT IS AN INDICATION OF A WEAK COIL, DEAD BATTERY, BROKEN OR LOOSE WIRES, ETC.
    When it sparked, all I got was a weak looking "white" spark from each wire. Is it possible there isn't enough voltage going to the plugs to jump the plug gap?
    Spark plugs & battery are new, coil & wires are used.
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2011
  19. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    LOl...Chuck isn't that what you try right after you say" Hold my beer and watch this"!!:roflmao:

    You could try making up something like this...
    ‪Race Bike Starting rollers‬‏ - YouTube

    I've also seen guys use long rollers and put their truck wheel in one side and bike in the other and start it like that...
  20. HarleysLR

    HarleysLR Active Member

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    That's what I'm talking about, those old kickers are hard enough to start when ever thing is prefect.

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