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First Dyno Pull Ever!!!

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Tech Talk' started by JohnnyBiker, Oct 6, 2011.

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  1. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    You know I did not ask if these numbers are with or without the V-ductor. I can get that information tomorrow. As far as do I plan to use the V-Ductor or not, I am up and down on that one. I know I can jet it for it, but if you look at the pulls, I made more power without it.

    TO ALL OF BIKE TALK :D Hot Rider likes the pipes that I have on. I have said this before, the pipes will be one of the last things that I do. I guess I do not care about bottom end torque all that much, I do not spend a lot of time riding in town, I am usually out in the country riding 65-100 mph..

    Just kidding guys, I am looking into different pipes. I just want to tune it first..:cool:

    Lucifer, that shim will come out. I wasn't real happy that it was put in in the first place.:witsend: Oh well. Hot Rider likes the Bassani Pro Streets...:cool:
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #41
  3. FLHTbiker

    FLHTbiker Moderator Staff Member

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    CB, I to was wondering the same thing about the Dyno and the pipes.
    Also been wondering, if your planning on a new bike JB, why dumping a bunch of money into the Sporty, just wondering.
    FLHTbiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #42
  4. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    To properly respond to the question, I said that I think that people put way too much stock meaning they live and they die by what the dyno says. I have a good article that indy gave me about dyno jet dyno's. I never said that I completely hate them, it is that they are held as gosphel. I think that they are a good tool to give you a rough idea of what is happening. Do I think that these numbers are exact?? Not by any stretch of the imagination. BUt I do think that it is accurately depicting a terribly tuned engine.

    FLHT, just because I am getting a "NEW BIKE" in no way means that I can't do this to this one.. Why do you and others insist on chastising my desire to improve this bike??? I am attached to this bike, this bike will never leave my family and it will never be neglected... That is all I am going to say on this subject......
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #43
  5. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

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    Like I said, It's looks or performance when you buy pipes for a bike.
    Then when you put the bike on the dyno, you see the results you are spending money on to look at a bottom end.

    This is the same color as my wife bike, same seat.
    If I changed the pipes it would be this or the supertrapp. But in chrome
    I'm a Big Supertrapp Fan.......
    Got their pipes on the bike I have now. HAd them on my last bike too.

    2008 1200N Harley Davidson - Dyno Tuned with Supertrapp Exhaust - YouTube

    [​IMG]
    cardboard, Oct 9, 2011
    #44
  6. cowboy

    cowboy Moderator Staff Member

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    JB if your looking into pipes , you need to get them & then tune it , or you'll be right back where you started , not picking on ya my Yankee brother just telling ya like it is :)
    cowboy, Oct 9, 2011
    #45
  7. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

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    Hey Redneck Cowboy, how would you put it that the rest of us has been trying tell him. Just pull his leg.........:rant::D
    cardboard, Oct 9, 2011
    #46
  8. FLHTbiker

    FLHTbiker Moderator Staff Member

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    Hold on there dude I was in no way chastising you but just wondering why as I'm sure others have as well.
    Your right the Dyno is a tool and in the proper hand can be a very useful tool to give you information that you would sit there and wonder about, just like it did for you with those current pipes you have.
    Listen to what others like HRK are saying as they have a lot more knowledge than you do on what to do. I think many are just trying to save you time and steps plus money in you quest for your bike.
    But let me again state that neither myself or others are chastising you about your bike but again simply wondering.:rolleyes:
    FLHTbiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #47
  9. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

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    He's wantin to do this on his own man
    Leave him alone.
    He can learn by his mistakes.:banghead:
    His Indy guy will guide him.
    At least the INdy guy likes the good cams.:gah:

    And I'm the last person he wants to hear say anything.....:D
    cardboard, Oct 9, 2011
    #48
  10. FLHTbiker

    FLHTbiker Moderator Staff Member

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    Well he will definitely learn then and good luck.
    FLHTbiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #49
  11. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    I am not looking into pipes at this current time... Everyone else if for me!!!:banghead::gah: Everyone keeps talking about bottom end!!!!! Who said that is where I am looking for power?????:gah::gah::gah:
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #50
  12. HarleysLR

    HarleysLR Active Member

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    got to have bottom end to get it rollin' or to have roll on power, it an't a toggle switch, off or on.
    do you expect HR to ride WFO all the time?
    HarleysLR, Oct 9, 2011
    #51
  13. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Just thinking of HR riding it too....if you build a bike for top end performance...bottom end will suffer...could be to the point where you'll have to "work" the throttle and clutch to be able to pull away from a stop light smoothly...now if those lights are a set of trees....different story...:)
    Lucifer, Oct 9, 2011
    #52
  14. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

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    Glad you took yer bike and had it Dynoed Johnny. Mabe it opened yer mind a little as to what yer bike is doing. And if you want to make any changes to it in the future and which way you might want to go.

    I believe in a Dyno machine. It is a valuable machine in a capable operator.

    Here I am at Wolfgang Grassers Shop gittin my last bike Dynoed.
    He found that the Power Commander V I had on my last bike that was giving me a problem, had erased most of the map on the tuner.

    Don't expect you to know who Wolfgang Grasser, but Cowboy does.

    Click on the picture



    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2011
    cardboard, Oct 9, 2011
    #53
  15. cardboard

    cardboard Well-Known Member

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    The dude with the dyno T-shirt is a bike builder friend of mine, he also builds bikes,
    He used to build drag bikes.He is over the house explaining tuning to me and another buddy
    Do i remember any of it.
    Well we was drinkin, and i have the CRS disease.

    He build the Wide Glide I had in 07 that was very fast.

    HE also build this bike


    dragstrip :: running down bagger video by claydbal - Photobucket

    [​IMG]
    cardboard, Oct 9, 2011
    #54
  16. Tomflhrci98

    Tomflhrci98 Active Member

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    Amen. You can play around and get the bike running a lot better than it is and have fun doing it, you don't have to spend a boatload of money if you don't want to. Those pipes you have aint stoppin you from running hard, bottom end, top end, whatever. Just shift it where it feels right.
    Tomflhrci98, Oct 9, 2011
    #55
  17. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    wfo???
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #56
  18. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I talked him into the dyno, not to prove anything but to
    get a baseline for any future changes, it's a worthwhile
    investment IMHO as you can't get where you want to go without
    knowing where you are.

    if JB wants top end power at wot that's fine but he's gonna have
    to spend some serious money to do it and make some serious changes
    for the 1200 to catch up to the goal.

    Vtwins are not HP bikes typically, yeah you can make HP but to make
    HP in a twin you have to make TQ, and sustain it at a high level
    and carry it out, HP is a math function of torques work at a given RPM

    Vtwins are bottom end tractor stump pullers, yes there are high HP
    drag bikes but when you look at street bikes you find the tq is good.

    My concern is the low flat and dipping tq curve where the bike is
    ridden most of the time and again JMO that bike will be a lot more fun
    with 85 tq from 2500 to 5000 than the same slow tq curve and 80 hp at
    6000, you're just not at 6000 enough to have fun. again JMO

    The pipes have huge inlets which takes volume to fill and they
    are probably the reason it is flat now. But HR and JB like them so
    thats fine.

    Woods cams are TQ cams call bobby and he'll tell you that
    yeah the HP comes but thats with RPM it's why it peaks
    after 5252 which is the constant in the equation it's
    the way the math works.

    Now you have a blueprint, you know where you are
    and the indy can help, but before buying anything
    fix the fuel curve and I think it's going to be hard
    to do without some tuning time because of the build..
    hotroadking, Oct 9, 2011
    #57
  19. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    I have a minimum number in my head that is acceptable to ME. If I absolutely can't get there with all current components first, the I will change it.;)

    Tom, here is the funny thing, no one on this site know what my minimum acceptable power level is. Just me and my indy know that...;)

    The levers that are on my left side are awesome.. And they work too...;)
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #58
  20. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    You have a limit on a vtwin, it's RPM
    nothing you can do about it but put in massive valve springs
    a long duration cam and high lift with high compression and
    then you'll need flow and you'll still have RPM constraints

    A GSXR or Busa have high RPM engines, try rolling off the line
    with a ricer high RPM low TQ High HP bike at 1500 and it will stall
    you have to give it RPM to get it moving.

    No matter what you do you can't change the physics of the
    engine design and cheat the math....

    Relationship with torque

    For a given torque and speed, the power may be calculated; the relationship between torque in foot-pounds, rotational speed in rpm and horsepower is:

    P / {\rm hp} = {\tau / ({\rm ft {\cdot} lbf}) \times f / ({\rm rpm}) \over 5252}

    Where P is power, τ is torque, and f is rotations per minute. The constant 5252 comes from (33,000 ft·lbf/min)/(2π rad/rev).

    So do you really want to drop $$$ in all this stuff including
    dyno time to hit some massive number and have a bike that
    is not fun on the street unless you rip the throttle open WOT

    Probably not. But it's yours, if you like that go for it.

    Build the TQ and the HP will come...
    hotroadking, Oct 9, 2011
    #59
  21. JohnnyBiker

    JohnnyBiker Well-Known Member

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    I have spoken with Bobby Woods himself, and he recommends the W8s cam. HRK, I understand, I am not going to buy anything until I get the fuel figured out. My comments about what numbers I am looking for were very realistic and I think very achievable with the current set up that I have. If I can get more out of it with the current set up great. I have jets on the way from CVP. Once they get here, then it is test and tune....:cool:
    JohnnyBiker, Oct 9, 2011
    #60
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