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Runs for few seconds

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Tech Talk' started by charlie46, Oct 22, 2013.

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  1. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Dang, those modern fuel tanks are complicated! Pinholes in the hoses, relays, check valves, fuel pumps, etc.

    What's wrong with plain old, simple gravity feed?
    joshbob, Oct 24, 2013
    #21
  3. charlie46

    charlie46 Well-Known Member

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    'Need 30psi to run fuel injection. Lot of people complain about new fangled gizmos on bikes. Just to say they run great and it's the first time in 71k miles the old girl had a breakdown. Older bikes are great too but, number of breakdowns don't compare with newer gizmoed up bikes, on average.
    charlie46, Oct 24, 2013
    #22
  4. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    Putting all that stuff in the gas tank hides everything, but makes it more difficult to access when something goes haywire?
    joshbob, Oct 24, 2013
    #23
  5. Fatboy128

    Fatboy128 Well-Known Member

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    Captain America HUD stuff in his tank! Just saying


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2
    Fatboy128, Oct 24, 2013
    #24
    HarleysLR likes this.
  6. baggerpaul

    baggerpaul Well-Known Member

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    fuel pressure spec for returnless Harley Delphi system is 55-62 psi ilike to see a min of 58 psi
    baggerpaul, Oct 24, 2013
    #25
  7. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    It's not bad Josh, you pull off a cover under the center console and you can see and remove the whole EFI assembly pretty easily...

    Pin holes in the fuel lines are not uncommon, you loose pressure and if the line breaks it won't run.

    I'd say the relay is good otherwise it wouldnt start, the pump wouldn't even initialize, if you were hearing the pump turn on it was getting power, if not, then I'd suspect the relay.
    hotroadking, Oct 24, 2013
    #26
  8. baggerpaul

    baggerpaul Well-Known Member

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    don't no how the code is written for description for code setting .what I was thinking hrk . is he might be getting a prime circuit for ten seconds and the ecm is not re grounding the relay for what ever reason . it states in his code no combustion found . so if its not seeing combustion it sees no reason to ground the fuel pump circuit ? spark sensing issuie ? rpm signal related don't have a code description for ecm setting the code .
    baggerpaul, Oct 24, 2013
    #27
  9. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Could be I dont' have the codes list either
    that makes sense too....
    hotroadking, Oct 24, 2013
    #28
  10. charlie46

    charlie46 Well-Known Member

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    I got the code list from hdforums.com. Lot's of codes possible, but just got P1353 & p1356. front and rear cyl. No combustion. No other codes were stored. doesn't tell me much. :asshat:
    charlie46, Oct 24, 2013
    #29
  11. hotroadking

    hotroadking Super Moderator Staff Member

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    The Delphi Ion Sense uses the spark secondary circuit (wire and plug) to "read" the combustion immediately following the spark signal. This information goes back to the ECM from the coil by a separate wire. Since the ECM is "thinking" there's no combustion at times there has to be an intermittent break in the channel of information if the "no combustion" determination is false. The only places such an interruption can occur is in the sparkplug, its wire, or in the wire carrying the information back to the ECM. Well, it could also be something in the coil or in the ECM, but check the simple things first...

    Without a good signal from the crank position sensor, the ignition timing will be all over the place and you will be lucky to get the engine to run at all. Check the wires leading from the crank position sensor for damage. It isn't uncommon for the sensor or the wires to be damaged when changing oil filters if the wrong type of wrench is used.
    hotroadking, Oct 24, 2013
    #30
  12. joshbob

    joshbob Well-Known Member

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    A lot of good it did him :D.
    joshbob, Oct 24, 2013
    #31
  13. baggerpaul

    baggerpaul Well-Known Member

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    THATS why I thought no rpm signal no reason to run the pump . just had a tech spend all day chasing his tail. car came in with a start and shut down . no codes present ! told him check for spark says its good boss ! CHECK FUEL PRESSURE ITS GOOD BOSS !scan for bad data stream all good! ok balls in my court now . so I check for spark . set my spark gauge for .050 no spark. I ask the young buck did ya check for spark ? yep sure did boss just like ya told me . so I said how ya check for spark ? stuck a screw driver in the plug wire and laid it on the head . dumb ass its real easy to jump a .010 gap . ten min job of a coil wasted all day chasing a bad diagnosing habit .sorry for venting . dam kids kill me some times
    baggerpaul, Oct 24, 2013
    #32
  14. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Do you mean a description of what the code is in the electrical diagnostic manual??

    ...My '03 book has the code P1353 & P1356...lack of continuity in the ignition coil secondary circuit or Cylinder is truly misfiring... and a description of what the secondary circuit is and it fires on ECM Pin 27 when it detects combustion,analyzed under load at 2000rpm
    Lucifer, Oct 24, 2013
    #33
  15. baggerpaul

    baggerpaul Well-Known Member

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    Well if its lean enough guess it would see a miss fire and set that code ! Then all falls in spark fuel and compression it has to run if it has all three! Suck squeeze bang blow just like the perfect wife . lmfao!
    baggerpaul, Oct 24, 2013
    #34
  16. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    :D Yeah....Seems like Charlie lost his bang.lol...could it be just loose or dirty connection where the cable plugs into the coil??
    Lucifer, Oct 24, 2013
    #35
  17. Fatboy128

    Fatboy128 Well-Known Member

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    You pick on Charlie you get both of us! [​IMG]


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    Fatboy128, Oct 24, 2013
    #36
  18. cowboy

    cowboy Moderator Staff Member

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    Well has the shop call you with any good news ?
    cowboy, Oct 24, 2013
    #37
  19. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    LOL

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    Lucifer, Oct 25, 2013
    #38
  20. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    LOL

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    Lucifer, Oct 25, 2013
    #39
  21. charlie46

    charlie46 Well-Known Member

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    Just came back from the shop. Plugs and pipes covered in soot. He's feeling that the engine temp. sensor is bad, causing it to feed too much fuel(like as to start) and not telling the ECM to cut back on fuel delivery after she's running. effectively flooding the motor. Waiting on new sensor. 'Hoping stealership has one stocked.
    charlie46, Oct 25, 2013
    #40
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